We need a friendly ENGINE, not a dysfunction EDITOR

We need a friendly ENGINE, not a dysfunction EDITOR
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#83

Well, if you want new users to become part of the community and using your products to make games, then wouldn’t that be a wise choice? Also, my suggestion is to have 2 sections, one for Newbies and another for Advanced… Nobody is born a programmer…

Precisely…

God Bless…

Sincerely,

Sunday


#84

Yes, and we can’t teach it. This isn’t what we do. We are a game engine and we can’t even teach people how to write games. There is a lot of variation and creativity. We could make samples of how you might do something, but this is open ones creativity.

You can write a Flappy Bird Clone is at least 3 different ways I can think of without trying to hard. What do we show? We show way A and someone wants then way B. We end up here on this same thread again.

What we need to do is document our product in the ways that make people understand how to use it and its pieces.


#85

@luke2125
Nope… Not everything… I am not sure how many open source community in past you’ve folllowed or seen apis of different game engines… None of them is sitting to create game tutorials!!
So, demanding everything is wrong… Obviously, why can’t they simply give a game template itself for the game you’ll release next? In that case, their engine will be most used!!

Feature description with working code of general and exceptional use cases is bare minimum responsiblity of engine developers as can also be seen in other engines. And it’s much appreciated to have 1-3 games in starting phase of engine. But asking further is being demanding. It’s a part of community and engine developers. Developers might add more things/use cases/catchy example with time… Also, game development using cocos engine can be part taken in conferences but not as integral/regular part from engine developers.


#86

Then don’t do anything, leave the status quo…God Bless…

Sincerely,

Sunday


#87

Whenever you write a angry comment. And write God Bless next to it. It looks like the most sarcastic thing in the world to me… :smiley: :smiley:

Anyways… read my last post. @slackmoehrle is absolutely right.


#88

I think best solve of problem about setup period is making a setup,debug,run,project manager app just like Marmalade Hub.Terminal and working with python files aren’t easy way to setup for beginners. Is it possible?

http://docs.madewithmarmalade.com/download/attachments/13042442/2016-03-24%2017-26-47%20Marmalade%20Hub.png?version=1&modificationDate=1462284966000&api=v2

http://docs.madewithmarmalade.com/download/attachments/10885141/MarmaladeHub.jpg?version=1&modificationDate=1426274451000&api=v2


#89

We had the Cocos Gui app, but it didn’t work as well as we had hoped and now it is EOL’d. The screenshots you provided was along the lines of what we had hoped for.


#90

Yeah, I also rem. it. I missed it. I raised the same need and I guess lot of other developers too… where required dependencies like NDK, etc will be downloaded by the GUI itself. Path variable also GUI can set or give instructions to set. And without any hassle, it’s ready to use in 15min-45min.
Even LibGDX follows the same.


#91

Well, I’ve been too a couple, like Defold, Libgdx, etc…Also, I’m not demanding anything, just giving suggestions, that could help the community. If you or @slackmoehrle don’t want suggestions as per engine, documentation improvements, then it’s fine by me. [quote=“catch_up, post:87, topic:33651”]

That’s not an angry statement, just letting him know, that if @slackmoehrle doesn’t feel comfortable in adding more documents to the already library of documents, then leave the status quo. God Bless…

Sincerely,

Sunday


#92

Yep I remember, you mean Cocos Launcher? But we were working with terminal setup way again in this time.

Imagine I’m a new developer, I’m making setup in terminal for osx, msdos for windows. Android setup is more complicated because it needs ndk, sdk…etc parts. I’m getting error in terminal window when I get an error. And environment variables don’t work stable sometimes. I’m getting error again again and again :smiley: I confess that at first it is not easy at all if you’re a begginer.


#93

Please stop implying what I want and don’t. Thank you.

I want suggestions for whatever you want to provide suggestions for. What I can live without is how folks that are not involved in how the engine is run trying to state matter of fact that “this is what you need” or “why didn’t you do it this way” or “what is taking so long” or “i have said this before”. Simply put these statements don’t help.

It is very easy for someone to say: “just put more people on writing docs”. Sorry, but you have no idea how hard this task is. You can’t just hire any person off the street and say write docs.

Again, I’d appreciate you not trying to communicate how I feel of what I am or am not comfortable with. You are taking my points and stretching them way out to then try and make your point seem more valid. This isn’t productive.


#94

Yes, the Launcher.

OK, I can feel you about working in a terminal. This can be scary. We could document this better so it isn’t so daunting.


#95

@slackmoehrle
I believe that thinking in these terms it the most complex way to design the documentation of something. Things should be built bottoms up, which is to start from what must be there and then thinking for whom all things should also be added.

For eg- Unix time irrespective of by whom or where is used, it remains universal and in need.
So, feature description with working code irrespective of kind of user is a must thing. Unity and some other engine follows the same approach. Our PG guide is better than them because you’ve added diagrams also.

Now, bring people:
1) Those who have never written a code must get there basics cleared. Or learn drag and drop engine! It’s not engine developers to teach them programming or even game programming
2) Coding experience but not game!! You or anyone can explain this with a very basic game which teaches the general game cycle! And then game engine specific cycle…

I talked about 3 Unity games!! Level of difficultly was exactly this. 1st game taught me to write in Unity as well as Game engine cycle. Benefit? I was making a game along with it.

3) That’s benefit for everything. They can also follow above kind of tutorials and learn Cocos engine life cycle first. Then they can always read documentations(extensive Programmers Guide)

4) Code is by itself well categorized. So, I dealing into dangerous part should be left on learner/developer itself in the starting phase.
5) That’s should be part of code writer of that api to clearly write what that api is about!
6) advance under pinnings can be, for me, shaders, etc! We can always have advanced topics in extensive programmer’s guide.

I’m telling you exactly how I learnt from poor programmer to understand Unity and how game development is done and then I picked Cocos2d-x

What’s I think is, extensive programmer’s guide should NOT be mixed with GAME! but feature description, EXACTLY like Unity Api Documentation but with diagrams.

Now, comes the good part where you can list tutorials, examples, use cases etc. in a separate section like Unity has.


#96

@pococogames has made this same point too. We should find a way to make the setup instructions cover the steps and potential failure points and how to fix. In a quick glance we don’t mention troubleshooting in these docs.


#97

I read your whole post. I agree with it. Implementation is now the next hurdle. These tasks are not overnight tasks. Perhaps a step by step road map might help and maybe encourage others to send in PR’s to help.


#98

Yeah, I was just expressing my nostalgia feeling. It’s long back, discussion in forums for the same thing and we then we had Cocos launcher :stuck_out_tongue:


#99

@slackmoehrle
I’m sorry I wanted to say… should NOT be mixed…


#100

yup, I realized.


#101

In fact, you did that :smiley: But maybe nobody don’t remember or know. Cocos Studio was an amazing tool about that. It was downloading true parts of requirments from web as automatic to setup.(ndk,sdk,python…etc) It was configrating other options. and more…

We need that part of Cocos Studio to make a setup application. And you may add useful help documents in the application. I think it’s better idea about that. If a beginner still can’t make setup after that point, maybe this guy should give up this job and find another job :smiley:

Of course, my humble opinion. Good luck.


#102

I’ll bring this up specifically, but I don’t know what resources there are or what the priority would be. I don’t make any of these decisions. My job is to communicate :slight_smile: